I voted for a conditional yes. They are beautiful (or at least detailed) models. Their manufacturing is the best – if they wanted, GW could put a power vein on Dante’s cock for you to paint.
Am I buying it though ? Nope. I’ve got everything I need for marines and no way am I starting a new army when I could pick up a new game. In the last 18 months, I’ve bought the big box, sm codex and a command sd. NO
I no longer feel that the models are worth the money, though I do have to agree with John that they are pretty detailed compared to most companies right now, though I’m not sure that’s a good thing or a bad thing. Does it really matter that I can paint a magnificent cock on my Crone or that theres 7 more skulls on the Chaos lords belt this year? If they spent as much time working on the rules to go with the models, I’d be changing my answer but for now, I’ll keep painting my space ships.
First, I’d just like emphasize that GW models are GORGEOUS. As a rule there are very few of their models that, given infinite time and money, I wouldn’t enjoy owning and painting.
However, since I do NOT have unlimited funds, there is no chance in hell that I’m starting a new army and paying GW prices for it. $210 for a horde of witch elves? $240 for a bus of 40 longbeards? Are they joking?
Luckily for us there are other companies out there producing amazing minis at a fraction of the price. I could buy GW VC skeletons at $30 for 10, or Wargames Factory skeletons at $20 for 30. Sure I won’t be able to play with them at my local GW…but they moved that store an hour-and-a-half outside the fucking city and don’t run events or tournaments there anyways. So what do I care?
I think that’s the key Liam, the fact that there are so many other options out there now that GW can’t keep acting like the “best quality models in the world” are worth 2 or 3 times as much as other models.
They’re the best models out there for sure, but they’re still overpriced. And this is someone who has rage-quit Warmachine twice already in just trying to build the starter set box (BTW, it’s pretty freaking awful).
There are other great model makers out there who make beautiful models, including GW subsidiaries. For some reason, I can still justify paying Forgeworld prices for Forgeworld models which admittedly have a pretty similar price tag and level of quality.
I think part of the cognitive dissonance is the fact that I remember what the price for models was ten years go. It’s like buying video games. We were buying video games for $60 ten years ago, and we’re not all that off for the price of video games today, but the quality is higher than they were 10 years ago. If games were 80% more expensive, I’m not sure if I’d still be buying games.
$550.00 Can to upgrade my ‘nids with 6 models (yes MCs …. some new toys and some stuff i’ve never needed in the past) ya not getting them…. i want to afford a house one day.
i’ve spent less and less on GW in the past few years. mainly buying books.thinking of selling down to one army just so i can get into other games….
you’d think the stock drop would be the kick in the crotch that they needed to wake up but oh wellll….
I said yes for the simple fact that if ppl had more confidence if the rules or the edition or GW had out a tighter tournament rules system for competitive ppl the price point of the stuff would be more tolerable. But with how this edition has gone and how the rules are going with expansion/data slates/FW there is no buyer confidence in picking up new stuff and having any fun with it at all…… So that makes the steep price point tough to swallow. If you new you could walk into a GW and had cofidence in picking up anything that isent a T Hawk and would have fun actually using it and not just putting it on the table to die in 5 mins then the price problem would be less of a deturent in buying new product
The models were rather expensive a couple of years ago at the end of the 5e run. Now that 6e’s come out the models are just way to freaking expensive. Esp given the fact that the darned things are styrene plastic now. Yes, it costs money to make molds, but only pennies to produce the models. They are just pricing themselves out of my gaming budget. There are plenty of other companies that make great models now. There are great companies that make models that are suitable for Playing 40k with. Forgeworld is also quite overpriced, and it’s clear to me that they really only want to sell to British customers. They can’t even be bothered to include prices in Dollars and Euros.
I have a huge collection of Marines, Orcs, Eldar, Dark Eldar. Mostly purchased years ago, but I do have some current models. Just nothing after the Dark Angels starter set was released.
As a wise male gigalo once said “Some things are just not worth the money.”
There is a problem when you have to throw a grand on the table to play a game with your friends. There are just too many alternatives out there to warrant any further investments in GW products.
They are still sort of worth it…as long as you get the ebay discount. Tbh the only reason I still buy stuff for 40k is that I already have most of the things I need already and will just pick up this or that for existing armies as they come out. I think it’s pretty much impossible to get into from scratch now. The game just has way too steep a barrier to entry, especially fantasy ($300 for a unit of witch elves? Go fuck yourself).
It sounds like you guys aren’t a fan of it but I’ve found home brew rules also has re-energized my interest. The best part of analogue gaming is that if something is stale or broken, you can just change it. I would encourage more people to try experimenting with minor tweaks to the game with their group, it has freshened up the game a ton for me.
I hit my breaking point. Then I crossed a line. I bought models from China. Then I even went so far as to Email GW, and explain why I have been making less and less purchases from them, and I even told them straight up I am buying Chinese models. I actually got a very polite email response from them. The customer service rep didn’t make even the slightest attempt to condemn me for buying knock-offs. I think the reps are just as frustrated with the costs as we are.
Some models worth it, some on the expensive side compared to cheaper better alternatives, some designs are like by that creepy uncle that knows best what teenage boys want (so not worth it then), and the game and rules in general are a factor requiring so many models to play and constantly needing to update your collection.
No one can deny the quality of GW models that have been released in recent years, but the cost is outlandish. Within 10 years (how long I’ve been playing) the price for most plastic boxed sets have doubled or worse. Now I know a lot of the new plastic model releases have been beautifully cast, and might demand a higher pricing, but the same moulds used 10 or more years ago have doubled in price as well. This is unjustified in my opinion. They’re not going to tell me the cost of plastic has risen that much. (?!) They’re very good at what they do, but their models, especially compared to some other manufacturers on the market, are not worth their often rediculous and ostentatious price tag.
I have no choice but to vote yes. Since I have just paid full retail for an Exocrine, Mawloc and several Warrior models, I have sadly lost ALL Right of Complaint. The score is – Saps, Zero – GW, Three. Way to Fight, Saps! I do buy used models with good discounts. I also make my own from Bit-Box pieces. I have found myself doing this more and more over the past couple of years. Premium Pricing Sucks!
It’s not that they are worth the money or not. The individual models are actually compedatively price. Example: 6 infinity models are about $40. 10 of the new dwarves are $60. Kinda comparable if you ask me. Yet I still I say nay my friends. The number of kits you need is crazy for the game as stated last episode.
GW wants to sell models to make their money. Hey, no problem. I’ll buy the minis… But do you know why I want the minis? It’s not because they are the best looking models. It’s because I want to play the game that goes along with the narrative that has been created. If the rules layer out make it that my favorite models from the fluff just simply dont do what they’d old have the power to do in the fluff then why would I ever want to buy them. GW would have us believe that it is because the models are great just because they look amazing and are well sculpted. If GW was truely is just a model company as they claim to be then they would pull out from making rules all together and just make models. Then watch to see how fast their stock price drops. Correct the course of your company, GW. Your rules and models are connected whether you like it or not.
I think it’s pretty clear that the way they are pricing things at this point is just not for people starting a new army or entering the hobby. They are pricing things to get the most money possible out of people who already have armies and just want to pick up a new box or two and/or the new army book.
For those 1-2 box customers–who are the majority–the question of price/value doesn’t really matter, and GW knows it, hence “fuck ’em”.
If you are trying to start a new Dwarfs army from scratch, yeah, go get some Avatars of War; GW doesn’t care about you anyways.
It’s a pretty shortsighted way of doing business but that’s what you get with publicly traded companies.
GW is absolutely saying fuck’em… but that doesn’t answer the question of “is it worth the money?”
The problem is not that us gamers won’t buy the product, we will. Even if the price is insane, we will still make it work for the sake of our armies and the game in general. However, that sad feeling in your gut after dropping $150 on that new book, box, and blister… that’s all the indication you need to know that it’s not worth it.
I don’t buy into the notion that people buy things that they don’t think are worth it, especially non-essential things like wargames.
When we finally stop buying it, I’d say then it’s not “worth it” but until that happens it clearly is, even if it stings.
The question is not are they “worth it” to buy, if it was I would agree with you. If you feel that you need something enough in terms of this game then buying the model basically proves you point.
The question is are they worth the money? Is the price tag appropriate or is it overpriced? Should the costs have doubled in the last ten years? The answer is quite plainly NO in my opinion since the models themselves have not seen an increased quality to the same standard. Here is another example of what I am trying to get at: I once had a car that required two new plastic clips for each of the sun visors since the originals had broken over the years. This was an expensive vehicle and the manufacturer had the parts for sale at a price of $55.00 per clip. It is absolutely worth it for me to get new clips for my sun visors, but they are not worth $55.00 each when I can find ‘used’ clips from a similar vehicle model at the pull-a-part for a fraction of the cost.
$55 for clips? That’s super annoying! But those aren’t a luxury you can do without, unless you are cool with driving blind with sun in your eyes. The idea of worth is a slippery subject, especially when it comes to things that we totally have a choice to buy or not, like model soldiers. Basically, they are worth what we are willing to pay. Maybe a better question would have been how many of us buy GW at full “fuck off” price, since most of us totally don’t have to if we don’t want to. I tend not to. So in that sense, no, they aren’t worth their full value to me.
Although technically not a model, I shall sum up my answer as thus “Tyranids Limited Edition Codex”. The correct answer is “no”.
Absolutely not. I have to disagree with what seems to be a trend here. I don’t think that GW models _are_ the best out there, and the quality doesn’t seem as tight as it used to be. For the Fantasy game, for example, the newer sculpts seem to repeat poses and design features such that there is a kind of generic quality to the units. Empire Spearmen and especially the new Ghouls, for example, are all nicely sculpted, but they are completely uninteresting when all ranked up. When compared to Mantic Ghouls (which are brilliant) and the historical plastics that the Perrys are putting out (40 figs for 30 bucks for really good sculpting), GW Empire and VC stuff seems just OK. I see some of the detailed work that GW is doing, and some of it is cool, but it’s all so overwrought; I can’t tell what the hell is going on with a unit of Chaos Warriors, even if the model by itself looks pretty good. Companies like Perry Miniatures, Warlord Games, Mantic, Fireforge, etc. seem to be doing plastic so well and for so little cost that the folks at GW start looking like a bunch of assholes for charging what they charge.
I think the issue, though, is that all of us are invested, and GW still comes off as the most accessible, the most popular of the miniatures games. Also, the models are around everywhere. I’m not going to start a new army with GW, but from the old days, from the second-hand market, and from the scores of rage-quitting gamers who are getting rid of their stuff for cheap, I have lots to paint for the armies that I am now playing. For this reason, I still find myself looking to see if there is anything exciting in the GW section of the game store, and I find myself hoping that they will come out with something that I actually want to buy (even though I know that it will be so expensive that I can’t possibly do it).
I voted yes but it’s a tricky one. The challenge with any question of ‘value’ is that it’s all about perspective. When we want something we change our reasoning to justify it and the reverse is also true. Attack Wing might be a great game but to me it’s overpriced and of no interest. Not because of the actual fiscal price but because I have no interest in space battle games at the moment and if I changed my mind I already have Star Trek vessels from back in the 90’s.
Sticking with your question though the actual models that GW puts our are typically high quality and the plastic box sets are resplendent with extra bits and bobs. Sounds like value to me and despite their price creep they are still comparable with other companies models. Particularly at the level of basic ‘soldier units’.
However where the value drops away in my opinion is when you consider the game systems as a whole. Whilst GW models might compare well with their competitors the GW games don’t. If you play them at the point size GW recommend the games become vastly more expensive and for me fall off the ‘value’ table.
And that’s why getting back to the hobby after a break of 15 years has seen me spend hundreds of pounds on figures from other companies and only purchase 36 skinks for use in a Dungeons and Dragons game I run. (And yes those are all the GW models I own).
SIDE NOTE – I know I am adding this on the night you will probably record but hopefully you will catch it and might do me a favour – my son James just played in his first 40k tournament (40k being good value to him) and he came 12 out of 20. Being only 16 I probably shouldn’t let him listen to you guys but I think a broad education is healthy so I let him. Anyway if you could give him a shout out he’d be both embarrassed and pleased … and any advice on how to win with Tau would be well received.
Hey guys – thanks for the shout out you did for my son – that got me many smiles and a high five! I would have thanked you sooner but a car crash (not my fault) a) hurt, b) totalled my car and c) set me back with regards to hobbies and casual gaming as I was focused on keeping on my feet and working! Thanks again for the mention – my son was delighted! Cheers guys, Archie
Jaded Gamercast 
I voted for a conditional yes. They are beautiful (or at least detailed) models. Their manufacturing is the best – if they wanted, GW could put a power vein on Dante’s cock for you to paint.
Am I buying it though ? Nope. I’ve got everything I need for marines and no way am I starting a new army when I could pick up a new game. In the last 18 months, I’ve bought the big box, sm codex and a command sd. NO
I no longer feel that the models are worth the money, though I do have to agree with John that they are pretty detailed compared to most companies right now, though I’m not sure that’s a good thing or a bad thing. Does it really matter that I can paint a magnificent cock on my Crone or that theres 7 more skulls on the Chaos lords belt this year? If they spent as much time working on the rules to go with the models, I’d be changing my answer but for now, I’ll keep painting my space ships.
First, I’d just like emphasize that GW models are GORGEOUS. As a rule there are very few of their models that, given infinite time and money, I wouldn’t enjoy owning and painting.
However, since I do NOT have unlimited funds, there is no chance in hell that I’m starting a new army and paying GW prices for it. $210 for a horde of witch elves? $240 for a bus of 40 longbeards? Are they joking?
Luckily for us there are other companies out there producing amazing minis at a fraction of the price. I could buy GW VC skeletons at $30 for 10, or Wargames Factory skeletons at $20 for 30. Sure I won’t be able to play with them at my local GW…but they moved that store an hour-and-a-half outside the fucking city and don’t run events or tournaments there anyways. So what do I care?
Answer: I don’t – I voted no.
I think that’s the key Liam, the fact that there are so many other options out there now that GW can’t keep acting like the “best quality models in the world” are worth 2 or 3 times as much as other models.
They’re the best models out there for sure, but they’re still overpriced. And this is someone who has rage-quit Warmachine twice already in just trying to build the starter set box (BTW, it’s pretty freaking awful).
There are other great model makers out there who make beautiful models, including GW subsidiaries. For some reason, I can still justify paying Forgeworld prices for Forgeworld models which admittedly have a pretty similar price tag and level of quality.
I think part of the cognitive dissonance is the fact that I remember what the price for models was ten years go. It’s like buying video games. We were buying video games for $60 ten years ago, and we’re not all that off for the price of video games today, but the quality is higher than they were 10 years ago. If games were 80% more expensive, I’m not sure if I’d still be buying games.
$550.00 Can to upgrade my ‘nids with 6 models (yes MCs …. some new toys and some stuff i’ve never needed in the past) ya not getting them…. i want to afford a house one day.
i’ve spent less and less on GW in the past few years. mainly buying books.thinking of selling down to one army just so i can get into other games….
you’d think the stock drop would be the kick in the crotch that they needed to wake up but oh wellll….
I said yes for the simple fact that if ppl had more confidence if the rules or the edition or GW had out a tighter tournament rules system for competitive ppl the price point of the stuff would be more tolerable. But with how this edition has gone and how the rules are going with expansion/data slates/FW there is no buyer confidence in picking up new stuff and having any fun with it at all…… So that makes the steep price point tough to swallow. If you new you could walk into a GW and had cofidence in picking up anything that isent a T Hawk and would have fun actually using it and not just putting it on the table to die in 5 mins then the price problem would be less of a deturent in buying new product
The models were rather expensive a couple of years ago at the end of the 5e run. Now that 6e’s come out the models are just way to freaking expensive. Esp given the fact that the darned things are styrene plastic now. Yes, it costs money to make molds, but only pennies to produce the models. They are just pricing themselves out of my gaming budget. There are plenty of other companies that make great models now. There are great companies that make models that are suitable for Playing 40k with. Forgeworld is also quite overpriced, and it’s clear to me that they really only want to sell to British customers. They can’t even be bothered to include prices in Dollars and Euros.
I have a huge collection of Marines, Orcs, Eldar, Dark Eldar. Mostly purchased years ago, but I do have some current models. Just nothing after the Dark Angels starter set was released.
I never considered that Forge World is biased toward UK buyers only… hrm!
As a wise male gigalo once said “Some things are just not worth the money.”
There is a problem when you have to throw a grand on the table to play a game with your friends. There are just too many alternatives out there to warrant any further investments in GW products.
They are still sort of worth it…as long as you get the ebay discount. Tbh the only reason I still buy stuff for 40k is that I already have most of the things I need already and will just pick up this or that for existing armies as they come out. I think it’s pretty much impossible to get into from scratch now. The game just has way too steep a barrier to entry, especially fantasy ($300 for a unit of witch elves? Go fuck yourself).
It sounds like you guys aren’t a fan of it but I’ve found home brew rules also has re-energized my interest. The best part of analogue gaming is that if something is stale or broken, you can just change it. I would encourage more people to try experimenting with minor tweaks to the game with their group, it has freshened up the game a ton for me.
I hit my breaking point. Then I crossed a line. I bought models from China. Then I even went so far as to Email GW, and explain why I have been making less and less purchases from them, and I even told them straight up I am buying Chinese models. I actually got a very polite email response from them. The customer service rep didn’t make even the slightest attempt to condemn me for buying knock-offs. I think the reps are just as frustrated with the costs as we are.
Some models worth it, some on the expensive side compared to cheaper better alternatives, some designs are like by that creepy uncle that knows best what teenage boys want (so not worth it then), and the game and rules in general are a factor requiring so many models to play and constantly needing to update your collection.
No one can deny the quality of GW models that have been released in recent years, but the cost is outlandish. Within 10 years (how long I’ve been playing) the price for most plastic boxed sets have doubled or worse. Now I know a lot of the new plastic model releases have been beautifully cast, and might demand a higher pricing, but the same moulds used 10 or more years ago have doubled in price as well. This is unjustified in my opinion. They’re not going to tell me the cost of plastic has risen that much. (?!) They’re very good at what they do, but their models, especially compared to some other manufacturers on the market, are not worth their often rediculous and ostentatious price tag.
Strictly no (it’s formed plastic), but if you look at it as an entry fee into the gaming community then I would say yes.
I have no choice but to vote yes. Since I have just paid full retail for an Exocrine, Mawloc and several Warrior models, I have sadly lost ALL Right of Complaint. The score is – Saps, Zero – GW, Three. Way to Fight, Saps! I do buy used models with good discounts. I also make my own from Bit-Box pieces. I have found myself doing this more and more over the past couple of years. Premium Pricing Sucks!
its all bull shit. fuck off GW.
It’s not that they are worth the money or not. The individual models are actually compedatively price. Example: 6 infinity models are about $40. 10 of the new dwarves are $60. Kinda comparable if you ask me. Yet I still I say nay my friends. The number of kits you need is crazy for the game as stated last episode.
GW wants to sell models to make their money. Hey, no problem. I’ll buy the minis… But do you know why I want the minis? It’s not because they are the best looking models. It’s because I want to play the game that goes along with the narrative that has been created. If the rules layer out make it that my favorite models from the fluff just simply dont do what they’d old have the power to do in the fluff then why would I ever want to buy them. GW would have us believe that it is because the models are great just because they look amazing and are well sculpted. If GW was truely is just a model company as they claim to be then they would pull out from making rules all together and just make models. Then watch to see how fast their stock price drops. Correct the course of your company, GW. Your rules and models are connected whether you like it or not.
I think it’s pretty clear that the way they are pricing things at this point is just not for people starting a new army or entering the hobby. They are pricing things to get the most money possible out of people who already have armies and just want to pick up a new box or two and/or the new army book.
For those 1-2 box customers–who are the majority–the question of price/value doesn’t really matter, and GW knows it, hence “fuck ’em”.
If you are trying to start a new Dwarfs army from scratch, yeah, go get some Avatars of War; GW doesn’t care about you anyways.
It’s a pretty shortsighted way of doing business but that’s what you get with publicly traded companies.
GW is absolutely saying fuck’em… but that doesn’t answer the question of “is it worth the money?”
The problem is not that us gamers won’t buy the product, we will. Even if the price is insane, we will still make it work for the sake of our armies and the game in general. However, that sad feeling in your gut after dropping $150 on that new book, box, and blister… that’s all the indication you need to know that it’s not worth it.
I don’t buy into the notion that people buy things that they don’t think are worth it, especially non-essential things like wargames.
When we finally stop buying it, I’d say then it’s not “worth it” but until that happens it clearly is, even if it stings.
The question is not are they “worth it” to buy, if it was I would agree with you. If you feel that you need something enough in terms of this game then buying the model basically proves you point.
The question is are they worth the money? Is the price tag appropriate or is it overpriced? Should the costs have doubled in the last ten years? The answer is quite plainly NO in my opinion since the models themselves have not seen an increased quality to the same standard. Here is another example of what I am trying to get at: I once had a car that required two new plastic clips for each of the sun visors since the originals had broken over the years. This was an expensive vehicle and the manufacturer had the parts for sale at a price of $55.00 per clip. It is absolutely worth it for me to get new clips for my sun visors, but they are not worth $55.00 each when I can find ‘used’ clips from a similar vehicle model at the pull-a-part for a fraction of the cost.
$55 for clips? That’s super annoying! But those aren’t a luxury you can do without, unless you are cool with driving blind with sun in your eyes. The idea of worth is a slippery subject, especially when it comes to things that we totally have a choice to buy or not, like model soldiers. Basically, they are worth what we are willing to pay. Maybe a better question would have been how many of us buy GW at full “fuck off” price, since most of us totally don’t have to if we don’t want to. I tend not to. So in that sense, no, they aren’t worth their full value to me.
Although technically not a model, I shall sum up my answer as thus “Tyranids Limited Edition Codex”. The correct answer is “no”.
Absolutely not. I have to disagree with what seems to be a trend here. I don’t think that GW models _are_ the best out there, and the quality doesn’t seem as tight as it used to be. For the Fantasy game, for example, the newer sculpts seem to repeat poses and design features such that there is a kind of generic quality to the units. Empire Spearmen and especially the new Ghouls, for example, are all nicely sculpted, but they are completely uninteresting when all ranked up. When compared to Mantic Ghouls (which are brilliant) and the historical plastics that the Perrys are putting out (40 figs for 30 bucks for really good sculpting), GW Empire and VC stuff seems just OK. I see some of the detailed work that GW is doing, and some of it is cool, but it’s all so overwrought; I can’t tell what the hell is going on with a unit of Chaos Warriors, even if the model by itself looks pretty good. Companies like Perry Miniatures, Warlord Games, Mantic, Fireforge, etc. seem to be doing plastic so well and for so little cost that the folks at GW start looking like a bunch of assholes for charging what they charge.
I think the issue, though, is that all of us are invested, and GW still comes off as the most accessible, the most popular of the miniatures games. Also, the models are around everywhere. I’m not going to start a new army with GW, but from the old days, from the second-hand market, and from the scores of rage-quitting gamers who are getting rid of their stuff for cheap, I have lots to paint for the armies that I am now playing. For this reason, I still find myself looking to see if there is anything exciting in the GW section of the game store, and I find myself hoping that they will come out with something that I actually want to buy (even though I know that it will be so expensive that I can’t possibly do it).
I voted yes but it’s a tricky one. The challenge with any question of ‘value’ is that it’s all about perspective. When we want something we change our reasoning to justify it and the reverse is also true. Attack Wing might be a great game but to me it’s overpriced and of no interest. Not because of the actual fiscal price but because I have no interest in space battle games at the moment and if I changed my mind I already have Star Trek vessels from back in the 90’s.
Sticking with your question though the actual models that GW puts our are typically high quality and the plastic box sets are resplendent with extra bits and bobs. Sounds like value to me and despite their price creep they are still comparable with other companies models. Particularly at the level of basic ‘soldier units’.
However where the value drops away in my opinion is when you consider the game systems as a whole. Whilst GW models might compare well with their competitors the GW games don’t. If you play them at the point size GW recommend the games become vastly more expensive and for me fall off the ‘value’ table.
And that’s why getting back to the hobby after a break of 15 years has seen me spend hundreds of pounds on figures from other companies and only purchase 36 skinks for use in a Dungeons and Dragons game I run. (And yes those are all the GW models I own).
SIDE NOTE – I know I am adding this on the night you will probably record but hopefully you will catch it and might do me a favour – my son James just played in his first 40k tournament (40k being good value to him) and he came 12 out of 20. Being only 16 I probably shouldn’t let him listen to you guys but I think a broad education is healthy so I let him. Anyway if you could give him a shout out he’d be both embarrassed and pleased … and any advice on how to win with Tau would be well received.
Keep on with the great shows. Regards, Archie
Hey guys – thanks for the shout out you did for my son – that got me many smiles and a high five! I would have thanked you sooner but a car crash (not my fault) a) hurt, b) totalled my car and c) set me back with regards to hobbies and casual gaming as I was focused on keeping on my feet and working! Thanks again for the mention – my son was delighted! Cheers guys, Archie